I was having a conversation with some friends about nudity, which got me thinking. I know a lot of people who, in the privacy of their own home, prefer to wear as little as possible. One of the people I was talking to thought this was disgusting, and I was the only one who didn't think it was weird and somehow degenerate. Maybe it's because my parents were hippies, but I think of nudity as a normal state. Then I thought about all those jokes and cartoons etc about naturism and nudist colonies, and it struck me that most people in my culture think of willing nudity - except when about to embark on an activity such as taking a bath or having sex - as something strange or perhaps a little bit perverted. Another friend of mine had a Swedish student staying with her once, with whom she had an interesting discussion about whether there was any connection between semi-public nudity and sexual behaviour. The student didn't see a problem with walking across the landing to her bedroom naked after a shower, in front of her host father. My English friends thought it inappropriate for a 20-something young woman to walk around naked in front of a 40-something man (I'm still not sure why they thought age had anything to do with it - I don't know if they thought it appropriate for a 40-something woman to walk around naked in front of a 20-something man, for example), as it suggested sexual availability. This helped me organise my thoughts a little. I personally wouldn't feel comfortable about being naked in front of people I didn't know, or many people I do know. But it seems perfectly normal to me to be naked in your own home or in front of family. It was the objections to this, what I consider to be private nudity, that I found surprising. Is public nudity more acceptable in your country than it is in the UK? Do you disagree with the prevailing norms? Do you think it's weird to be naked in your own home, and, if so, why? (I wonder how many people will feel compelled to respond to this with a joke, and how many of them will be English...)
A man walks into a bar. Ouch! You asked for it... My opinion is basically the same. There's no problem with nudity in the privacy of your home, there would only be a problem if you inflicted it on someone who would be offended by it.
The thing is, isn't the notion that you are 'inflicting' your nudity on someone a cultural thing? As would be taking offense at it.
I'm resisting the comuplsion ! In France public nudity isn't perfectly accepted, although the tolerance level to naked women and men in adverts and so-on is a lot higher than in England for example. And not just for shower gel. Nudist camps are quite popular (compared to England, still) but I guess the climate does help with that too, it's probably a lot more comfortable to walk around naked in Nice than it is in Brighton... It's still much joked about and so-on among the general population and a marginal activity. Personnally, I don't mind being naked around the house, as long as it's just me and Hubby, but I usually wear a wrap (we brought a few back from the carribean) just because it's more practical (especially if cooking or doing something that could involve spilling or getting dirty or hurt...), and more because I like the feel of something on my skin more than because of the visual considerations. Hubby usually just wears boxers. I'm not too shy about removing my clothes at least partially in front of doctors, or in a common changing room, but I'm not full comfortable with it either, mainly because I know what my body looks like and I don't enjoy looking at it so I consider other people shouldn't have to more than necessary. I guess this is a fairly common girl thing, but hey, that's just me... I don't consider home nudity abnormal or perverted at all, I'm slightly less comfortable when it includes a family with children, but that's also a personal thing, like I don't like parents kissing their kids on the lips, it's just a personal hangup, I don't like it, but I won't go ranting on at the people in question and calling them freaks or whatever, it's their choice. Basically, as long as everyone present is ok with the nudity, then fine, go ahead, but if anyone is uncomfortable with it, then the should make it clear, politely, and it should be understood by the people who enjoy it...
I'm a "lapsed" naturist. :smile: I spent my childhood holidays running around naked on naturist campings. Around puberty I started to feel selfconsious about my body, as most teenagers are wont to be. Still, I went to naturist campings 'till my 18th, even one time with my best friend (Who wasn't a naturist), my sister and my girlfriend (Who was a naturist, I had met her the year before on the same camping.) After that I became a student and didn't really have money to go camping. Plus I didn't have any friends that were naturists. I like walking around unclothed, but the house I live in now is rather cold. Even in high summer it doesn't get warmer than 25ยบ C. My parents are still naturists and will walk around the house naked if they don't have guests. My dad is part of the Dutch federation of naturists and is a member of the board of the biggest naturist organisation in the Netherlands. As for sexual tension. I only know that as a 17 year old, when I was on holiday in France on a naturist camping, during the day you wouldn't even so much as flirt with the opposite sex. (It's hard to hide your arrousal if you are nude...:redface The whole holiday flirt thing came alive at night, when everyone got their clothes on...
Well, yes, partly - there are obviously those who buck the trend in each particular country. The English are generally quite reserved, but I can't really speak for any other culture.
To me it's another in a long list of irritating hang-ups that some cultures have. LIke you said, in the UK many people only associate nudity with baths, showers and sex - so any time they see or think of nudity they only think in these terms, most often connecting nudity to sex, which is why we still have a childish sence of humour connected to nudity and why we think of tabloid papers as selling sex when, most often, they're just selling nudity which is, or should be, a totally different thing. The tabloid industry would go bust smile if nudity became generally acceptable to everyone. Still, people are wearing less and less all the time, especially celebtraties and pop stars, so I'm sure it wont be all that long, another couple of decaded perhaps, before singers are strutting around naked in their videos. Being naked at home is totally fine and one day, when we all grow up as a race, being naked anywhere will also be fine and be as remarkable as seeing a naked fish.
I have a bit of an unsual view one this one. When people say it is natural to be naked, I disagree. It's just biological to be naked. It's natural for us to wear clothes. We spend the majourity of our lives in them. On the whole, I don't see the appeal in naturalism, I like clothes, they keep me warm and have pockets for keeping stuff in. Really, there is only so many things one can hold in a buttock. Having said that, I don't have a problem with it. I spend a couple of days staying with a work mate once, who having only known me for a week or two was quite happy to be naked all the time in the house. While at first I was like, what the hell, it didn't bother me at all. It's just another person walking around. However, this is wear my intense shallowness comes out, I do think nudity is for the attractive, if he was really fat I probably would have had more of a problem with him being naked. Likewise, I while I enjoy my waif physic, I don't think the rest of the world would get the same pleasure from my skeletal frame. This is more of an aestic thing, it's not that I think only hot women should be naked (but I do encourage it), more that just I think if your going to parade your body about it should be one worth parading. Like I said, massively shallow.
I know it's probably just a random typo, but just to clear one thing up before this gets really started : [WIKI]Naturalism[/WIKI] [WIKI]Naturism[/WIKI] Different things :wink: I really don't mind naturalists walking around in the street, in fact, I don't even notice. :biggrin:
The thought that someone could see the body, the naked body at that, as somthing that must be related to sexuality creeps me out a little. Mal stated it very well: Nudity and sexuality should not be seen as the same. And people going over the top by finding a naked small kid on the beach or a breastfeeding mother inappropriate have a little fixation, and other people's fixations shouldn't make impact on my life. Taking care not to make anybody feel awkward about themselves or the situation is something different. That's something I think I do, and the reason why I wouldn't walk around naked in front of strangers in their home - or in front of guests in mine. After all, I don't know how they would feel about it. Well, I think the inflicting-upon does play a role. I would adapt to the culture I am visiting, for example, and keep closely dressed on a beach in any more reserved country. I think context plays a role. Over here, it is normal to go to mixed saunas (both genders, same rooms), and the sauning takes place naked (towels are to be sat on, and to keep you warm during your resting phase if you want to). For some reason, it doesn't matter to anyone, because everybody is just as naked, and you get people of all ages and sizes. It is a totally asexual situation, because, as I said, everybody's just equally naked, and someone aware of their own nakedness wouldn't stare at you. If some of these people were dressed, that would make it a more awkward situation. This is one case, though, where everybody agreed to see other people naked. I think that is far more natural than many situations fashion and certain club scenes create, that has everybody involved dressed, but women always less so than men. (Note that I am aware it is not dictated upon the women to join this competition, which in this case, it is.) In public baths, the situation is different. A naked bather would cause... estranged looks. Every place has its code. (Water nearby somehow seems to play a role.) It is considered normal though to shower naked after swimming - in gender divided showers in this case, though. I wouldn't mind my daughter hopping to me under the shower - she somtimes spontaneously decides to do so when she sees me taking one - I'd be rather glad she willingly agrees to a washing of any kind. (We normally don't lock the bathroom door when we take a shower, when it is just the three of us at home, although espacially my husband and I have always taken care to keep up some private sphere for each of us, and respect the other one's). On the other hand, she sends me out of the bathroom very often when she's on the toilet, and I'm quite glad she's able to articulate her wish for private sphere, and always gets it. If she would be ashamed of me seeing her naked, I'd respect that, no matter how old she is - there would be problems right now due to her still needing my help, but well. I am too glad she defines her personal boundaries at all, I'd never overrule them. I am, so far, far from uncomfortable about her seeing me naked, though. I also find it normal to dress in front of close family members. Or friends. But not always, and not everybody. My sister is fine with it, my mother not so much, and I act accordingly - I think this is as hard to define as anything that has to do with personal space, from the distance you keep from someone when talking to them, to nakedness.
Buzzfloyd having spent the last thirty years out of the UK experiencing various cultural norms, my opinion is that religion plays a greater role in determining whether the naked human form is accepted. Being from a repressed Victorian-value British upbringing myself, where nudity was not acceptable no matter the practicality, I learned to accept that other countries and non-religious based cultures accepted that clothing was unneccessary to get around in 35+ degree temperatures. It amazes me that there is such a chasm between religious followers and their strictured clothing uniforms and the normalists. It is observable wherever you go in more temperate climes.
Well religion and culture are linked but elaboration may be necessary. The acceptability of the naked bodies in certain situations is culturally defined and to some extent a culture is influenced by prevailing relgious beliefs. Worst case of culture shock and nudity I heard of was friends in Malaysia. She was a nonconformist Malay muslim, ie she wore western clothes and not head scarf. But she did grow up in a culture of conservatism surrounding not being naked in front of anyone but you sexual partern (husband). She got engaged to a Finnish guy while he was on exchange in malaysia. At the end of that year she went back to Finland to meet his family and on the first night she was there the whole family got naked together in the sauna. Perfectly normal for them but freaking her out because of all sorts of issues to do with nakedness, respect for parent figures and proper modes of behaviour that were ingrained from her culture. Its hard to shake that stuff off and be comfortable in an unfamiliar situation, especially if you've get to get your kit off too. Besides the beach Aussies generally keep there clothes on. Mostly, it not acceptable for women to swim topless, but they can sunbath topless (even this is usually done face down so the boobs aren't showing). On Bondi beach in Sydney you can tell the European women cos their the ones in the water with no top on. Locals put their swimmers back on to get in the water. Don't ask me why but it could be because I surf is a lot rougher and jumping over waves can cause serious boobage flop.
I would pay good money to see that printed in black and white warning message style on cans of beer, frisbees and other beach apparel packaging
I can see that, but evidently religion alone doesn't cause UK-style attitudes to nudity, or Sweden and Germany would be equally uptight, being religious countries.
Hmm... I remember our first summer in the United States, and being VERY surprised at seeing all the little girls - like, two, three-year-olds, - running around in chest-covering bathing suits (either one or two-pieces, the two-pieces looking especially silly, since there was nothing for the top part to cover or support). Back in Kiev, I didn't get my first "real" swimsuit until I was at least 10. Also, no one batted an eye at children changing in and out of wet clothes in full view of the entire beach, which was convenient for the parents, I'm sure - they didn't have to run around looking for a changing booth - but VERY embarrassing for the said children, when the photos were brought out, a decade or so later.
Wasn't there a joke posted recently which was based on a bunch of ladies screaming about a four year old boy accidentaly coming into the ladie's changing room? I was surprised at that. I'd also be surprised at people frowning at a naked three year old at the beach. If we dress three year old children at beaches, or anywhere where the sun and water are to be enjoyed, it is for sun protection.
It also wouldn't explain how there are nude beaches all over Portugal, a decidedly Catholic country. We also get boobage on TV all the time. During prime-time shows even. (22:00, so most children will not see it, but still, prime-time national TV) Also, any soap (and boy, do we get a lot of soaps) that airs after 21:00 has some breasts in the intro (Except the ones that are aimed at kids, obviously)
Ditto Italy. While we lived there, my Dad kept trying to distract my brother and me whenever we walked past newsstands, because they'd inevitably have a few issues with topless women on the cover... Eventually, my Dad got tired and had to give up p.
