... but this is ridiculous. But then everything is a choice, don't allow people to have sex with kids and goats, or free train travel? Dammit, I'm torn...
:shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: If it wasn't on Reuters I would think it was a joke. I'll just pray that it is and Reuters have mistaken today for April 1st in which case they just have a sick sense of humour.
Actually, my impression as a non-Dutch resident, is that the Dutch will defend to the nth degree the right to form a party and campaign on whatever crackpot issue you care to put forward, no matter how morally repugnant. The election papers here are like very large posters, with a huge array of candidates and parties. The chance of such a political party ever having electoral success are so close to zero that it isn't worth worrying about (thankfully). That said, the age of consent here is 12 (although consent can be withdrawn sunsequently up to the age of 16) Dutch nationals will no doubt correct me if I'm wrong!
I think South Park sumed it up best: [quote:ae4c25e37d="South Park, Episode 4.05: Cartman Joins NAMBLA"][i:ae4c25e37d]Lead Agent[/i:ae4c25e37d]: [to [i:ae4c25e37d]NAMBLA Leader[/i:ae4c25e37d]] We've been after you for a long time, buddy! Do you know your rights? [i:ae4c25e37d]NAMBLA Leader[/i:ae4c25e37d]: Rights? Does anybody know their rights? You see, I've learned something today. [[i:ae4c25e37d]Stan[/i:ae4c25e37d] and [i:ae4c25e37d]Kyle[/i:ae4c25e37d] look at each other] Our forefathers came to this country because… they believed in an idea. An idea called "freedom." They wanted to live in a place where a group couldn't be prosecuted for their beliefs. Where a person can live the way he chooses to live. [[i:ae4c25e37d]Stan[/i:ae4c25e37d], [i:ae4c25e37d]Kyle,[/i:ae4c25e37d] and [i:ae4c25e37d]Cartman[/i:ae4c25e37d] look at each other] You see us as being perverted because we're different from you. People are afraid of us, because they don't understand. And sometimes it's easier to persecute than to understand. [[i:ae4c25e37d]Stan[/i:ae4c25e37d] and [i:ae4c25e37d]Kyle[/i:ae4c25e37d] look at each other, then at the [i:ae4c25e37d]NAMBLA leader[/i:ae4c25e37d]] [i:ae4c25e37d]Kyle[/i:ae4c25e37d]: Dude. You have sex with children. [i:ae4c25e37d]NAMBLA Leader[/i:ae4c25e37d]: We are human. Most of us didn't even choose to be attracted to young boys. We were born that way. We can't help the way we are, and if you all can't understand that, well, then, I guess you'll just have to put us away. [shots of [i:ae4c25e37d]the agents[/i:ae4c25e37d], then the Brando look-alikes, then [i:ae4c25e37d]Stan[/i:ae4c25e37d] and [i:ae4c25e37d]Kyle[/i:ae4c25e37d], who look at each other, then at the [i:ae4c25e37d]NAMBLA leader[/i:ae4c25e37d]] [i:ae4c25e37d]Kyle[/i:ae4c25e37d]: [slowly, for emphasis] Dude. You have sex with children. [i:ae4c25e37d]Stan[/i:ae4c25e37d]: Yeah. You know, we believe in equality for everybody, and tolerance, and all that gay stuff, but dude, fuck you. [i:ae4c25e37d]Kyle[/i:ae4c25e37d]: Seriously.[/quote:ae4c25e37d]
... And the Family Values League, or whatever, reads this article and screams: "SEE!!!!!! We TOLD you that legalizing gay marriage opens doors for pedophilia and sex with animals!" (Pennsylvania's own senator Rick Santorum actually claimed this )
Democracy is great. I have the right to say that these guys are retards and the only up side of what they've done is out themselves as pedophiles so the police know who they are...and where they live and hopefully won't vote for them. The senate (upper house) electoral form here is a table cloth that you can't fold small enough to get in to the slot... There is the 'Outdoor Recration Party' (ie Shooters), 'Help End Marijuana Prohibition' (ie pot heads), 'Facist Party' (is Mussolini wannabes), 'Communist Party' (ie plain wankers) and the best of all 'The Fishing Party' (ie bums)... Its no wonder everyone just votes for the big two in this bi-partisan system.
I shall start a Bunny Party, also welcoming worshipers of anything sausage and also encouraging spoons.
Strange political parties are nothing new - parties such as this have been about for a long time - there is also the National Front/British National Party or whatever they are calling themselves nowadays - sometimes these parties are a joke and sometimes they are serious - this lot in The Netherlands are already shooting themselves' in their collective feet by even [i:03759d1199]mentioning[/i:03759d1199] Marc Dutroux - he was kidnapping and killing young girls - he even had the nerve to blame the police for the two who starved to death in his hidden cells in his cellar because he was in prison for some other crime and so couldn't feed them! The problem is, if you are going to have democracy, it must be [i:03759d1199]total[/i:03759d1199] democracy - as soon as you put limits on who can stand for election, you have tyranny - too many advocates of democracy are inclined to say "But we never meant that people like [i:03759d1199]that[/i:03759d1199] should get elected!" - in this case, I think that Dutch children (and animals!) are pretty safe - despite the traditional Dutch tolerance, I don't think this lot will get many votes!
am i the only one quietly wondering what swreader's reaction to that is going to be? i think i better get some affidavits that i'm american and have never been on the european mainland...
[quote:ca09e3edf1="sleepy_sarge"]That said, the age of consent here is 12 (although consent can be withdrawn sunsequently up to the age of 16) Dutch nationals will no doubt correct me if I'm wrong![/quote:ca09e3edf1] I think I read something about this, but I can't for the life of me remember where. If anyone can confirm it, please do. As it is, if it's true I find it to be rather fucked-up. We had a case here last year of a junior soccer team trainer having sex with just about the entire group of young boys he trained at the time, aged 12-14. None of them filed a complaint, and as far as the kids were concerned they did it of their own free will. To earn the "respect" of their trainer. The whole case became public when one of the parents got suspicious. The police later found lists of him keeping tabs of how the boys... performed. So this would be legal in Holland as long as the kids didn't complain? Pardon me, but that's sick. [quote:ca09e3edf1="Pixel"]he problem is, if you are going to have democracy, it must be [i:ca09e3edf1]total[/i:ca09e3edf1] democracy - as soon as you put limits on who can stand for election, you have tyranny - too many advocates of democracy are inclined to say "But we never meant that people like [i:ca09e3edf1]that[/i:ca09e3edf1] should get elected!" - in this case, I think that Dutch children (and animals!) are pretty safe - despite the traditional Dutch tolerance, I don't think this lot will get many votes![/quote:ca09e3edf1] Would refusing a man with a criminal record as long as your arm to run for office count as tyranny? A convicted murderer, rapist, etc.? There's no such thing as freedom without limits, nor is there such a thing as democracy without limits. Total Democracy would devour itself simply because the people who reach public office (and trusting in the intelligence of the public isn't much of a solution. The *public* doesn't have any intelligence), later subvert it for their own personal goals. Most dictators get elected in this very manner. The difference between laughable and dangerous is the person that's doing the laughing. [quote:ca09e3edf1="Garner"]am i the only one quietly wondering what swreader's reaction to that is going to be? i think i better get some affidavits that i'm american and have never been on the european mainland...[/quote:ca09e3edf1] Heh, better hurry before it's too late, man.
[quote:12254b5d17="Roman_K"] Would refusing a man with a criminal record as long as your arm to run for office count as tyranny? A convicted murderer, rapist, etc.?[/quote:12254b5d17] If the voters are stupid enough to elect them, then they deserve them.
The age of consent is 16 here. The thing is, the idea is morally repugnant, but the age of consent is a valid debateable political point. Culturally, however, it isn't a point of debate. This isn't going to change anything, because it doesn't fuel any sort of political discussion on the issue itself. It survives on the negative media attention and civilised outrage. It will die out quickly, once the obvious jokes have been made and prejudice has been fed a bit more.
[quote:e2a63d0283="Ba"][quote:e2a63d0283="Roman_K"] Would refusing a man with a criminal record as long as your arm to run for office count as tyranny? A convicted murderer, rapist, etc.?[/quote:e2a63d0283] If the voters are stupid enough to elect them, then they deserve them.[/quote:e2a63d0283] Yes, but do all the other people who *didn't* vote for them deserve them? In a multi-party electorial system, where the percentage a party must get to enter parliament isn't all that high, just about any party can get enough votes if it has enough financial backing behind it for publicity. Sure, that percentage can be raised, but how high? So, should a country have a convicted rapist in parliament just because 8% of the voting populace are not only morons, but easily influenced morons?
