Join me in your shock and disgust

Police cite two students for having sex in school

But here's the scary part:
This is where I live.
I know kids who go to this school.
This is the main rival of the school I attend.
Hell, I almost WENT to this school!

It's all anyone was talking about today - and no one was impressed.

What is the world coming to? *shakes head and mourns her generation*

I don't think it's a big deal either. They are both above the age of consent. (Well, I think so. It's 17 in New York.) A lot of fooling around went on when I was in high school, and that was over 20 years ago.

Personally, I think the police should spend more time trying to catch real criminals.

LOL Classic.

[quote:950477a943]
“They actually were viewing the sex act,” Finnell said of the students, “because that’s what makes the public indecency.”
[/quote:950477a943]

Now this may just be the phraseing of it, but that sounds to me like the police are saying that it's only a public indecensy because they did crowd. Now that may well be the case but I'm still think that the wording is a little edgey, like it s mattor-of-fact kinda statment. I'm not quite sure how to phrase what I mean but I know that isn't right.


[quote:950477a943] the two were caught in a hallway where card tables and folding chairs are stored.

“about 12 students who were behind the gate that is locked near the swimming pool, came to the gate to see what what was going on

through a window, saw a female student on top of a male.

opened the door on the east end of the hallway [/quote:950477a943]

some interesting geography that place has, I'm really struggeling to picture this. (the location not the act :roll: )


[quote:950477a943]he saw the student going around the corner and pulling up his pants.
the girl was still on the floor, unclothed from the waist down.[/quote:950477a943]

has anyone heard the song "smooth criminal"?


Anyway whats worse is that I myself almost got taken down to a police station for kissing a girl friend in school! The police were visting (for some un-known reason), they saw us kissing and dragged me away! Saying that it was sexual harrasment! OK the sex in the corridoor I can understand but kissing!

Anyway back to the coridoor, I agree with Hex. That is one of the most retarded thing I've heard about students in a wile. Of all the places :roll: Another thing crosses my mind, It was claimed that this was after school and that at least 12 other students were witnessing the act. Why were there so many students at school after school time? OK this sounds like a large school, so I find it stranger that they would all be in that area. I think that the police report is flawed but the that doesn't change the fact that THAT WAS JUST WRONG

[quote:68f3e8c3d1]

. Why were there so many students at school after school time? OK this sounds like a large school, so I find it stranger that they would all be in that area. [/quote:68f3e8c3d1]

We used to have lots of afterschool activities when I was in high school.Drama, band, newspaper, etc. So there were often students in school after hours, and they would all be in the same area of the school because they were all supposed to be working on the same activity together. Don't they have those anymore?

This doesn't shock me. I'm can imagine it's not exactly uncommon. There were enough hormonal teenage couples around when I was at school, anyway. Not everyone can demonstrate sensibility and restraint when they've got the chance to do something naughty and rebellious.

Not that I'm defending their actions. Randy little brats. Give them detention and write their parents an embarassing letter. But don't arrest them. What shocks me more is that 12 other pupils were watching them. Pervs!

Sounds like you chose the right school there, Hex.

They do (although we don't do newspapers over here (or at least where i am)), however when your on such activities your useually acompanied by a teacher or two. They wouldn't be left to wander around the buliding like the report suggests

We were left to wander. Teachers don't work past the hours in their union contract.

OOh well, we're always under strickt orders to sit down and get on with our work... although we useually just talk to the teacher the whole time

If you think thats scarey, I live in Brooklyn, NY and there was a storey in the papers about a little boy in Kinderarden who was expelled because he was caught kissing a little girl. This whole PC thing is getting ridicules. I believe they concentrate on the small silly stuff so that the big stuff gets right past us.

To clarify what I think Dane is saying - the reference appears to be that people were voluntarily watching - but then surely by watching they were becoming part of the act, and therefore not "public" (there must be something in physics about observers and the observed interacting - it's probably quantum) - if they did not want to watch they could just move on - it's not as if they were "doing it in the street and frightening the horses" (a slightly archaic reference - can anyone tell me where it came from - I can only remember the phrase - or possibly paraphrase?)
Since it was a hallway used for storage, I assume that it was not normally a route for students getting from one place to another. Is it so unusual for people to find an isolated spot for a little bit of nookie (for Americans, I believe the term is "fooling around" - I don't know for anyone else). One of my ex-girlfriends and I had a favourite little alley (we were both living with our families at the time, despite both being in work) - is the real problem that people seem to have perceived is that this happened in a school?

I find this whole thing rather amusing actually.

Don't think anything like this has ever happened at my school* (curse going to an all-girls). But I remember last year myself and a friend saw a young female teacher going into an empty classroom in a quiet part of the school with the male teacher that many had dubbed "Mr Hugh Jackman". I wonder what they were doing. Hur hur hur. Oh how we did laugh. Then went and told everybody we knew. I hope the teachers were very embarrased.

* discounting kissing between friends and people getting felt up.

[quote:dd6cf3f4ec="Pixel"]
Since it was a hallway used for storage, I assume that it was not normally a route for students getting from one place to another. Is it so unusual for people to find an isolated spot for a little bit of nookie (for Americans, I believe the term is "fooling around" - I don't know for anyone else). One of my ex-girlfriends and I had a favourite little alley (we were both living with our families at the time, despite both being in work) - is the real problem that people seem to have perceived is that this happened in a school?[/quote:dd6cf3f4ec]

I think the problem isn't so much where it was done, but the fact that it was done at 12. 30 PM - during a lunch break. And the fact that they couldn't find anywhere else to do it...

But it is funny, and has led us to find more reason to mock our key rival school in Lincoln (Southeast kids hate Southwest students, for a multitude of reasons). Most people find it more amusing than disturbing, but I just think it further shows the moral degredation of today's youth. But that's all I have to say on that subject.

Moral degradation of today's youth?....

I might be going out on a limb here, but what's so immoral about it? For all you know, they were both using protection and thus not putting anyone in danger of pregnancy/diseases. Granted, they could have picked a more practical spot and saved themselves (and the school) the embarrassment, but other than that...?

Who knows how many kids have done the same, but didn't get busted.

Moral degredation? I blame chavs

The current teenage steriotype (from adults perspective) in England at the moment is that they're all anti-social, vandaliseing (spling?), Bad mouthed, arrogent, obnoxiouse (again spling?) little bastards that hang around in large groups (which I've several times heard being refferd to as mobs) all of which wear huddies. I dispare. The most unfortunate thing is that its true, but only for a small poportion of youths. We call them chavs.

They're the most pathetic thing to ever hit the social scene. Often their IQ is below 75 and will almost always attack people with anything higher than that. A prime example of the rise of chavs is my very school, when i was in year 7 (the first year of high school) Everyone in my year would avoid the year 11's for fear of being beaten up, our currnt year 7,8,9 all think it's fun to hurl abuse at us and punch us (although often they havn't the foggiest how to punch :roll: ).

This group of youths without any respect for anyone is the embodiment of degredation.

[quote:24ca1f581e="Hex"].....I think the problem isn't so much where it was done, but the fact that it was done at 12. 30 PM - during a lunch break..[/quote:24ca1f581e]
So - is sex only allowable at certain times - rather like the British pub licensing laws until recently?
[quote:24ca1f581e="Hex"]And the fact that they couldn't find anywhere else to do it....[/quote:24ca1f581e]
One finds where one can when the urge is upon you!

In my experience teenagers have sex wherever and whenever they can get away with it. Evidently in this case they misjudged the getting-away-with-it part.

As someone has already said (excuse my laziness, I only have one hand right now), the part I find disturbing is that there were people who wanted to watch! And, come to that, that the couple weren't put off by being watched!!

I'm sorry, i just can't agree with tha Mal. A wile ago a teenager got the #### kicked out of him and died because of it. That happend not far from me (Burnley :roll, it got coverage across England. The sad a little known fact is that the child that died was a bully, the two kids that kicked the #### out of him were standing up for themselves and were made out to be monsters by the media. Not that agree with them killing him but they were provoked beyond any point that I could have been arsed to take.

I'm not sure what happend to the two kids but I have no doubt that it has been worsend by the fact that the media blew it way out of porportion. Another incident of bullying, not long ago when the laws on what teachers can do to restrain pupils was intorduced a girl got slashed across the face. The very day that the new laws were put in place she got a pencil sharpner blade to the face, why? Because she was standing up against bullies.

She was made a hero for getting her face slashed. In both cases there were large groups of people watching, does that make it sick? Is that what makes it moreally wrong? Is that what makes it disturbing? That people could have stopped it but didn't? the act is wrong not the location or the audience. Although with the sex in school case I think it's the opposite, the location and audience were wrong not the act.

[quote:b6613ab5d0="Hex"][quote:b6613ab5d0="Pixel"]
... Is it so unusual for people to find an isolated spot for a little bit of nookie (for Americans, I believe the term is "fooling around" - I don't know for anyone else). ...[/quote:b6613ab5d0]

... Most people find it more amusing than disturbing, but I just think it further shows the moral degredation of today's youth. But that's all I have to say on that subject.[/quote:b6613ab5d0]

Says the person who comes from the country of Benny Hill.

Oh, and Pixel. Both nookie and fooling around are used... By OLD people! BUAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHA! As I'm getting somewhat old myself, I don't know if there's some higher speed term than 'making out', which what it was called in my day *grabs cane*

Sorry, although that last parahraph does make sense, it doesn't make very good sense

Basically she was made a national hero for standing up against bullying. But what makes that incedent sick? That people could have stopped it or where it was done?

Anyway, I suppose your right. getting the #### kicked out of you isn't murder or being slashed. The acts of the bully weren't reported, its only when its something big like murder and when the face is slashed on the day of new laws comeing into effect to try to tackle that kind of thing.

The bully did get the #### kicked out of him, just to the extent that it killed him. The girl also got the #### kicked out of her then got her face slashed. On the whole bullying is reported in news papers etc but rarely specific cases and only ever when its related to a more trivial or seriouse issue. For example the laws comeing into effect then she gets slashed, had she been slashed the day before the only attention she would have got would have been from a doctor. A trivial example would be Justin Timberlake (a pop star), he was bullied for being spotty in high school. The only reason that example of bullying was brought to light was for his fame.

On the whole people don't care about bullying, only when it's attatched to something else do people give a damn.

[quote:e38f1baac0="Maljonic"]I don't think there was anything morally wrong in what the couple were doing, nor do I think that it's disgusting or shocking. If anything it demonstrates how backward-thinking many people still are regarding sex by making such a big deal of it. Especially if you consider if it were two people kicking the shit out of each other with people watching instead, which is disturbing and morally wrong, that it wouldn't have got a mention anywhere beyond the local vicinity and would soon be forgotten.[/quote:e38f1baac0]

I feel the same, it is nothing new that teenagers do that. It happens much more than people would think, much more. They choice of location is not even disturbing (a little sad yes).

What is disturbing is the watching crowd. It you think about it a "watching mob" has become so common and disturbing these days in a myiad of places.

If these kids are convicted of a crime (although I don't know under what law), they will be considered former "sex offenders". What is that going to do to them when they try to look for a job, buy a house, etc.?

[quote:1f190a0015="Hsing"]I also would, like Mal, say that incidents where someone got killed or mutilated don't fit the comparision... Honestly said, when did you read the last time "Student got bruised and severely punched while others looked" in the news before?
[/quote:1f190a0015]

Several times, though I must say that it's rarely in the big papers.

[quote:1f190a0015="Marcia"]If these kids are convicted of a crime (although I don't know under what law), they will be considered former "sex offenders". What is that going to do to them when they try to look for a job, buy a house, etc.?[/quote:1f190a0015]

*shrug* If there wasn't a crowd of students that came to watch, then it wouldn't have been a crime. As there *was* a crowd of students that gathered, it was a crime. Why? Because a school is a public area, storage and all. You only have sex in a public area if there's no crowds about because being *caught* having sex in a public area when there's crowds is what public indecency means. Heck, crowds aren't always mandatory, for that matter. Having sex in a public bathroom still counts as public indecency.

As does flashing.

Now, I doubt the kids were expecting a crowd, but if they kept it up when said crowd was there...

Let 'em deal with the consequences of stupidity.

Would they be really tried as "sex offenders?" Why not something like "indecent exposure" or "lascivious public behaviour", which hopefully won't throw them into the same category as child molesters?

[quote:d218a13e95="mowgli"]Would they be really tried as "sex offenders?" Why not something like "indecent exposure" or "lascivious public behaviour", which hopefully won't throw them into the same category as child molesters?[/quote:d218a13e95]

Indecent exposure counts as a sex offence in many places. Flashers and the like. What's the law for this sort of thing in the UK?

Hex is in the US. The laws differ from state to state. And there is a difference between the laws that are on the books and the laws that are actually enforced. There are also sometimes harsher penalties for things that take place on a school grounds.

I'm curious what the police were doing there anyway, unless the school already has a problem with drugs, guns and crime, because schools with those problems use police as security. Otherwise, did a faculty member or student spot them and call the police on them? I could understand maybe suspending them from classes or some other academic punishment, but having them arrested is going too far.

edit: found this, in a Google search for Nebraska penal code:

Public indecency; penalty.
28-806. (1) A person, eighteen years of age or over,
commits public indecency if such person performs or procures, or
assists any other person to perform, in a public place and where
the conduct may reasonably be expected to be viewed by
members of
the public:
(a) An act of sexual penetration; or
(b) An exposure of the genitals of the body done with
intent to affront or alarm any person; or
(c) A lewd fondling or caressing of the body of another
person of the same or opposite sex.
(2) Public indecency is a Class II misdemeanor.

To give an idea of the severity, shoplifting up to $200 worth of things is also defined as a class two misdemeanor.

This thread caused a flashback to my highschool days, there seemed to always be a few couples engaged in pretty heavy petting, to use a phrase that was old fashioned even then, I remember practically tripping over them in the main hallway and being concerned for the two classes of fourth graders who shared our building and were sure to have to see all the PDA. I remember seeing gum swapping in front of the administration offices.

If Minnesota had the same public indecency laws as Nebraska and they were enforced to the letter they would have had to fine about a quarter of the student body every week.

I'm glad the horizontal phase of the human mating game doesn't last too long. I don't need any more obstacles to trip over.

[quote:b776421f62="Marcia"]Hex is in the US.[/quote:b776421f62]

Right, forgot that for some reason. My apologies.

[quote:d2c08e670b="Marcia"]I'm curious what the police were doing there anyway, unless the school already has a problem with drugs, guns and crime, because schools with those problems use police as security. Otherwise, did a faculty member or student spot them and call the police on them? I could understand maybe suspending them from classes or some other academic punishment, but having them arrested is going too far.[/quote:d2c08e670b]

To far yes, somehow I think that the presence of the watching mob forced harsher punisment than just suspension from class.

Any form of sexual activity should only be a crime if someone non-consenting is being harmed by it* - no-one is going to be harmed by seeing people naked or having sex - they only have to look away if it upsets them (and then possibly go for psychiatric treatment because they can't accept something which is a natural part of life) - people are all different - I know of a couple who's big turn-on was having the husband watch his wife having sex with another man - maybe being watched was something the couple concerned in this thread enjoyed - why should two people enjoying each other be a crime?

*I would stress the "non-consenting" bit here - there was a case in the UK a while ago when assault charges were brought against a group of masochists - I don't know how the charges originated - but were dismissed because everyone involve was consenting - the right decision.

Without saying anything one way or the other about the morality of the act in question....

If you read the article closely you will find some dispute over what actually went on. The principal said the crowd gathered after an administrator discovered the students and started talking to them. The police stand by a different chain of events that had the crowd gathered before the administrator arrived.
[quote:22740b9070]
“They actually were viewing the sex act,” Finnell [the officer] said of the students, “because that’s what makes the public indecency.”[/quote:22740b9070]
This sounds more like the police have little to charge the students with other than public indecency. If no one was watching, was it still a crime?

[quote:df000469ed="Rincewind"]I dunno, there is a time and a place for everything. I'd be pretty pissed off, if i went to the cinema and had to share a row with a couple doing 'the deed.' As long as it's in a somewhat vaguely discreet place thats fine.[/quote:df000469ed]
Unless they were being so noisy that you couldn't hear the soundtrack, or so energetic that they were vibrating the row of seats, why would you be pissed off? In fact, given some films nowadays, their activities might be better value for money than the film you had paid to watch!

[quote:a8135989ca="Pixel"][quote:a8135989ca="Rincewind"]I dunno, there is a time and a place for everything. I'd be pretty pissed off, if i went to the cinema and had to share a row with a couple doing 'the deed.' As long as it's in a somewhat vaguely discreet place thats fine.[/quote:a8135989ca]
Unless they were being so noisy that you couldn't hear the soundtrack, or so energetic that they were vibrating the row of seats, why would you be pissed off? In fact, given some films nowadays, their activities might be better value for money than the film you had paid to watch![/quote:a8135989ca]

Because there's a time and a place for everything, and sex is not a public event. Do you have so big a problem with the fact that folks might be bothered by a live sex-show they don't want to watch? And frankly, your comment on sending those bothered by it to a psychiatrist verges on the idiotic.

If they were watching, how much would the other students have seen anyway. Looking into a darkened corridor, with chairs and tables stacked around, from 70 feet away.

Heard maybe, but seen :? .

[quote:58ebcec040="jaccairn"]If they were watching, how much would the other students have seen anyway. Looking into a darkened corridor, with chairs and tables stacked around, from 70 feet away.

Heard maybe, but seen :? .[/quote:58ebcec040]

Once the door was open, I presume light got into the hallway.

[quote:509f9da5a0="Roman_K"][Do you have so big a problem with the fact that folks might be bothered by a live sex-show they don't want to watch?[/quote:509f9da5a0]

But in the case of the students, nobody was forced to watch. It was all consensual. This isn't comparable to being in a theatre, where you would have to witness the sex if you want to see the film, which you've paid to see. But in the case of the theatre, the crime wouldn't be having sex, but disturbing other patrons. Just like someone talking loudly on a mobile phone in a theatre.

There are a lot of things I don't want to [i:2c339c3606]have[/i:2c339c3606] to see - ugly people, ugly buildings, dead animals at the side of the road - in fact dead animals anywhere except on a plate in pieces and cooked - piles of dogshit on the pavement* (still something of a problem in Brussels) - many other things - so I just avoid looking at them (except for things I want to avoid stepping in) - but that doesn't mean I deny their right to exist - apart from the dogshit.

In case people are getting the wrong idea about my sex-life - I am extremely conventional - on the occasion that my girl-friend of the time set up a threesome with another man, I ended up banished to the spare bedroom because I found the whole situation so funny (it didn't help that they being both actors and me being an actor/technician, I was the one who had to keep getting up to change the music on the CD player) and when she set up a foursome (two of each) I was so inhibited I could not "perform".

However, I do not expect everyone to have the same habits/preferences as myself - and to follow up on Hsing's comment - if it came to a choice, I would rather watch a couple having sex than someone picking their nose!


*Sidewalk for the Americans among us.

Edited for spelling

Hsing - I believe in being open about things- I wanted people to know that I wasn't arguing the point because [i:cc79ee1916]I[/i:cc79ee1916] wanted to have sex in public - I would be seriously inhibited if I tried and the examples I gave were to illustrate that - but I was defending other peoples' right to do so - I'm talking natural moral right here, not repressive laws.

You were also giving us way too much details about your personal life in the progress.

I for one did NOT need to know that. (I don't need to know anything about [b:cd0261383d]anyone's[/b:cd0261383d] sexlife here. Not just yours)

[quote:9a4e9a5031="Tephlon"]You were also giving us way too much details about your personal life in the progress.

I for one did NOT need to know that. (I don't need to know anything about [b:9a4e9a5031]anyone's[/b:9a4e9a5031] sexlife here. Not just yours)[/quote:9a4e9a5031]

The thread title is now more appropriate than ever

[quote:b1d4a55a28="Rincewind"]I dunno, there is a time and a place for everything. I'd be pretty pissed off, if i went to the cinema and had to share a row with a couple doing 'the deed.' As long as it's in a somewhat vaguely discreet place thats fine.[/quote:b1d4a55a28]

This happened to me when I went to see Pirates of the Caribbean - we waited behind to watch the credits and have and M & M fight, and a couple were getting their groove on in the third row.
It was disturbing, though at least their noise didn't drown out the soundtrack.

[quote:5b1dd701cb="Electric_Man"][quote:5b1dd701cb="Tephlon"]You were also giving us way too much details about your personal life in the progress.

I for one did NOT need to know that. (I don't need to know anything about [b:5b1dd701cb]anyone's[/b:5b1dd701cb] sexlife here. Not just yours)[/quote:5b1dd701cb]

The thread title is now more appropriate than ever[/quote:5b1dd701cb]

[quote:c028e40d63="Orrdos"]Yeah, pixel, no one wants to read about you shagging.[/quote:c028e40d63]
Actually, if you'd read the post carefully you would have seen that I didn't - either time! I was making the point that despite the situations set up by my then girl-friend, group or public sex is not my thing - but I don't condemn other people for it just because I don't want to do it.

I have just checked back to the beginning of October, and I can only find three posts where I refer to my sex-life - all relevant to the discussions at that point - the naked proposal, the alleyway, and the problems of more-than-a-couple sex - I don't see why this should be a cause for complaint

[quote:7987af8a63="Pixel"]I have just checked back to the beginning of October, and I can only find three posts where I refer to my sex-life - all relevant to the discussions at that point - the naked proposal, the alleyway, and the problems of more-than-a-couple sex - I don't see why this should be a cause for complaint[/quote:7987af8a63]

There's also a mention of an old girlfriend sending you a link that I remember offhand, which you shared. For no apparent reason. It sticks to mind. Add it all up, and it gets manky.

[quote:7987af8a63="Pixel"]Hsing - I believe in being open about things- I wanted people to know that I wasn't arguing the point because [i:7987af8a63]I[/i:7987af8a63] wanted to have sex in public - I would be seriously inhibited if I tried and the examples I gave were to illustrate that - but I was defending other peoples' right to do so - I'm talking natural moral right here, not repressive laws.[/quote:7987af8a63]

No, people don't a moral right to have sex in public. Because other people have kids, Pixel. And plenty adult folks are bothered by sex in public, Pixel. And having live porn in the neighborhood park is not good, Pixel.

Also, no one said *you* wanted to have sex in public. No one even alleged to this. Saying what you said just now would have sufficed if you felt your words could be taken the wrong way.

As for moral rights...

Shit's also natural. Why shouldn't I take a dump in the comfort of the street? Or the university? After all, the bathroom's oh-so-far-away, and I shouldn't be bothered with going all that way if I can avoid it, right?

Also, we eat meat. That meat comes from a dead animal, which needs to be *made* dead before it goes to stores (unless you're extremely cruel). So, why should I slaughter animals in a remote and closed facility when I can do it in front of my home? Buy a cow, slaughter it in front of my home and a large gathering of my neighbors (they can take a bit if they help with the quartering), clean up any unneccecary bits after I finish taking what I need, and cook away. :roll:

Some things you don't do in public, Pixel.

OK, Garner - point taken - I'll be more careful about what examples I use to illustrate my points in future.

[b:7bf8533fac]Posted on behalf of Garner: [/b:7bf8533fac]
[quote:7bf8533fac]Thanks[/quote:7bf8533fac]

NB This post refers to the original topic, not to more recent posts!

Recently the BBC showed a documentary about naked ramblers.

You can see a summary here (work and family safe link unless they are [i:93ffdfc6aa]really[/i:93ffdfc6aa] uptight about these things)

My take on that (and on the original post) is that it is a lapse of taste to impose one's naked body and/or acts of intimacy on members of the public who don't share the same outlook on life. I found it humorous however, and was saddened to see the energy the police put in to arresting these people time after time.

On the original topic of public shagging, if that took place in the Millenium stadium in front of an invited crowd of 80,000, I would say good luck to them, but showing your bits in front of other people only works if everyone is in on the deal.

A lapse of taste or judgement then, but surely NOT a crime worthy of police attention.

(edited typo)

[quote:9acdb7867e="Maljonic"]Burn your clothes! [/quote:9acdb7867e]

[i:9acdb7867e]Warning: Remove clothes first. Burning clothes still attached to the body can be hazardous to health. Burning clothes may contain traces of flame and smoke.[/i:9acdb7867e]